Reader Comments:

Views expressed in submitted comments are that of the author, and not necessarily shared by Railnews.

• Bob , London

  The 455s are not being replaced. This is for growth. As SWT get no subsidy getting more paying people onto trains to give the government more money.

• This guy from the South, Egham, Surrey

  For Signor Lutz, the primary function of the class 458/5 fleet is for the Weybridge via Staines line and the Windsor line. The function of the 456s is to lengthen double class 455 trains to 10 car trains for the urban routes on the South Western Mainline and the Kingston loop line. When all of the 458/5s are in service, the 450s used currently on the Weybridge and Windsor lines will be cascaded to the Waterloo to Reading line, and the remainder to the SWML. Once this fleet is in place (and if SWT retains the franchise), this fleet will be used for the Waterloo to Reading line and outer suburban services to Basingstoke and Alton. The 450s will be cascaded to spare routes. South West Trains dream is to become a 10-car railway. The class 444 fleet are already 5 car. The 458/5s are 5car. The 455s coupled with a 456 will be 10 car in total (4 + 4 + 2). I personally think that if SWT retains the franchise, either the 450s will be lengthened or they will be cascaded to the Thameslink, Southern and Great Northern franchise or the Integrated Kent franchise. Basically any routes that have third rail. Or maybe being converted to class 350 for the West Midlands franchise so they can work with overhead lines. This is me speculating, but it is what I think will happen.

• This guy from the South, Egham, Surrey

  So, South West Trains are ordering yet another bunch of trains. Used for outer suburban services, so you say? I completely understand most of the people on here. South West Trains have received two 'new' train fleets in the space of two years, and here they are, ordering another set of trains. I am personally on the London Waterloo from Reading line, so I guess I will be impacted because I heard somewhere that these trains will also go on the Reading line. I guess it is good, what with the class 458/5s and 456s arriving. The only thing I am concerned with is the lack of mainline journeys on this line, despite the existence of a junction close to Weybridge connecting the Chertsey loop to the South Western Mainline. I wish there was a bigger range of services, but never mind. There are a very limited amount of electrified services in the North of England, and most of the Northern diesel services are made up of the infinitely lame, useless, cheap, noisy, uncomfortable scrap of metal they call Pacers. If anything, at least those units should be replaces. Class 175s anyone? To be fair, the Sprinters are as bad as the Pacers. I could be biased as down here in the South, we have the wonderful Class 158s and 159s.
  
  IN CONCLUSION: The North generally does need more funding with fleet and electrification. The Waterloo to Reading line needs a more diverse range of services. BUT, it is good to have extra capacity brought by the class 458/5s and eventually this class as well. We do need the capacity, but the north does need it too.
  
  (The new SWT Class 700s are for inner suburban services -- specifically, the Windsor line.--Editor.)

• MikeB, Liverpool

  @Lutz, London. Merseytravel is basically responsible for organising the replacement EMUs for Merseyrail but, as with similar negotiations for other new trains, the procedure is taking longer than we all would like. Indeed, well-maintained EMUs - such as class 507s built in 1978 - could last for 50 or 60 years but if that is the case, the Class 455s, delivered in 1982 should last until around 2032 before they are replaced.
  With regard to Northern, they probably will receive extra trains but these will unlikely to be new-builds but older cascaded units.

• Lutz, London

  @D, Newcastle
  Northern and Transpennine are already in-line for extra vehicles commensurate with the level of anticipated patronage.
  @John Gilbert, Cradley, Herefordshire
  These new vehicles are apparently to be allocated to the Windsor inner suburban services so they will be configured as high density.
  
  Diesels; The RDG (not the DfT) owns this (since about 2010 - they are onlt the second iteration of the rolling stock plan), but has concluded that there will be no more than a 'potential' requirement for 50 diesels in the next 30 years; the existing fleet will be cascaded to cover all requirements. As regards a new build of diesels; the current engine designs meeting existing EU requirements will not fit into any of the existing UK diesel train designs, so making any new build an expensive bespoke build. Better to electrify or use new technology to avoid the problem.
  
  Merseyrail is entirely responsible for the current situation; they appointed a team to look at replacing the fleet more than two years ago, and have spent £3.4M on the project, but still with no outcome. Anyway, well maintained electric vehicles should have no problem with lasting 50-60 years in service so the current fleet is only just over half way through its potential service life; any failings can be attributed to the way they are maintained.
  

• Tim, Devon

  I think the EU regulations are a bit of a scape goat. There are diesel engines that can meet Stage IIIB. Sticking one in a DMU can't be that difficult.

• Melvyn Windebank, Canvey Island, Essex

  Those up North who complain about new trains for London should remember some like the new S Stock and trains for the overground and the recently added West Anglia routes are being ordered by TFL and the London Mayor.
  
  West Yorkshire ordered new trains many years ago so you should be challenging your road dominated councils as to why they want to spend millions on a few metres of new road and not on new local trains ?
  
  As for diesels a problem in meeting EU emission targets is already making it almost impossible to order new locomotives from January and no doubt similar problems may affect new DMUs .
  
  The solution re DMUs is to fill the small gaps in electrified networks like the route to Uckfield which would remove DMUs from London Bridge and thus release them for parts of the country where DMUs prevail. In fact 100% electrification of both Southern and South West Trains using AC /DC could free up DMUs for the North but the DFT needs to see sense re further 3rd rail electrification where it frees up DMUs and that doesn't just apply to London !
  
  Tests are about to begin on a battery electric train and if these prove successful then battery powered trains might help towards solution to replacing DMUs where electrification can't be justified on cost ground.

• MikeB, Liverpool

  Jim Campbell states that Merseyside has an extensive electric network. Indeed, we have the excellent Merseyrail but the current fleet of class 507s & 508s are now around 35 years old and, whilst some refurbishment has been carried out over the years, they are now extremely "long-in-the-tooth.". New trains have been promised but decisions keep being deferred and the latest date seems to be around 2018. In the meantime, orders for new trains for the South seem to be announced on a monthly basis.

• David Faircloth, Derby

  Regarding the editor's comment that these will be used on Waterloo - Windsor services; as these trains are shown in all publicity shots painted in the SWT red livery, does it mean that the Windsor service is being downgraded from outer suburban (blue liveried trains) to inner?
  (Not really a comment from me so much as additional information -- it's in the notes on the original release. The 700s are essentially inner suburban sets in my opinion, though, unless the internal configuration is to be different for SWT.--Editor.)
  

• Jim Campbell, Birmingham

  Why the bleating from the north. Manchester has Metrolink, Newcastle the Metro, both extensive networks, merseyside has an extensive electric network.
  Plans for more growth with Rail North.
  What about the West Midlands. Britains second city expected to be grateful for a few yards extension of its one tram line.

• MikeB, Liverpool

  Whilst the North West is getting some long-overdue electrification (albeit mainly with cascaded EMUs built in the 1980s), we will still have to put up with Pacers and Sprinters for at least another 10 years until more lines are electrified, as new-build DMUs now seem highly unlikely. Even with further electrification in the regions, the South East will undoubtedly continue to benefit from the next generation of EMUs straight off the production lines and areas such as the North and South West will probably continue to get their cast-offs

• Tim, Devon

  Still no new DMUs. Areas of the country still reliant on Diesel are going to be using very old trains indefinitely
  

• John Gilbert, Cradley, Herefordshire

  I agree totally with D. of Newcastle. It is intolerable that the north has to make do with the cast-offs from the south-east.
  On another matter, it is to be hoped that the new trains for the SW lines will have seating, (and NOT too hard either please!) arranged in a manner suitable for long distance runs such as London to Weymouth and Portsmouth, rather than forcing passengers to cram into unsuitable class 450 type units for these longer runs.

• D, Newcastle

  Yet again new trains for the South of England! Let's see how many new trains Northern Rail get when the franchise, wonder what odds Ladbrokes would give me for betting none!

• Lutz, London

  Fantastic, and much appreciated ... but which lines are going to get them?
  (Waterloo-Windsor, it seems, as 10-car sets. Trains on other routes will be strengthened using stock cascaded from the Windsor line.--Editor)

• David Cook, Broadstone, Dorset

  The smart move is that SWT and Network Rail are getting together to improve Waterloo, by opening up the Channel Tunnel platforms, and extending some of the shorter platforms at Waterloo, thus allowing longer trains and helping maximise the capacity of the SW main line out of Waterloo. That will involve a lot of track/points/signals moves, and quite a lot of work ahead. Being a regular user of this heavily used line, this improvement is more than welcome.